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points by Jnr 4 days ago | 0 comments
No political censorhip? Try asking Chinese models about Taiwan.

Some censorhip and bias towards certain ideology is baked into those models.

While it is not a problem for programming tasks, I would never use it for certain other tasks.

[–] Gareth321 4 days ago
> No political censorhip? Try asking Chinese models about Taiwan.

Self-hosting means being able to use abliterated models where the superficial instructions like not describing Taiwan as independent are burned off.

Censorship and bias are related but not synonymous. I agree that it's harder to remove political bias when the training data includes it. We know many of the frontier models are heavily trained on Reddit, for example, [which likely explains why we see such heavy left wing bias.](https://trakkr.ai/bias/findings)

More citations:

https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/faculty-research/working-papers... (article: https://news.stanford.edu/stories/2025/05/ai-models-llms-cha...)

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/29974100.2026.2...

https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/10817610

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/interactive/2026/0...

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11127-023-01097-2

[–] schiffern 4 days ago

  >abliterated models where the superficial instructions like not describing Taiwan as independent are burned off
Does this help with issues like including security vulnerabilities when you say you're in Tibet? I understood that this was burned in at the training level, not just a layer of censorship added at the last minute.

https://www.crowdstrike.com/en-us/blog/crowdstrike-researche...

[–] Gareth321 4 days ago
It could, but it's an inexact science. A little bit like tampering with the brain. Even a surgical procedure removing a tiny tumor can interfere with critical pathways. Usually abliterated models end up almost exactly as capable in benchmarks, but it requires the person doing the abliteration to anticipate or know about the censorship. In the case of Chinese model censorship it is believed that it is post-training, so the underlying data input is not the issue. It's how the model has been trained to use that data. Specifically, abliteration usually targets the refusal behaviour. I would guess that this example could be significantly improved, but I have not seen any abliteration attempts re this specifically.
[–] Jnr 4 days ago
All good points, but I am not sure who I trust less. Chinese companies or random people on Hugging Face. :) It is still a black box. And I have a feeling I could not abliterate those models on my own hardware.

I am not saying I would not use any of them at all, but I would avoid doing certain tasks with them. And with the testing I have done with abliterated models in the past, it is not 100% successful and it can still hit the same walls as original model.

[–] Gareth321 4 days ago
I agree. I think the future for privacy conscious people is going to be an adversarial open weights model, where competing models (ideally from opposing superpowers and labs) critique each other's work to find consensus. Or at least alert for suspicious behaviour.
[–] xeyownt 4 days ago
So... the Super Intelligence is Democrat?
[–] scotty79 4 days ago
After years of trump any intelligence is a democrat.
[–] pluralmonad 3 days ago
The only winning move...
[–] scotty79 3 days ago
Is to deprive yourself of the slightest chance of winning?
[–] deepersprout 3 days ago
> No political censorhip? Try asking Chinese models about Taiwan.

In open models you can "uncensor" them: https://arxiv.org/abs/2406.11717