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points by Toutouxc 1 day ago | 0 comments
Oh wow, it’s like they’re trying less and less.

When they introduced the Apple Pencil and people were like “haha it’s a stylus”, the thing was decidedly NOT a stylus (it actually couldn’t be used to control some parts of the UI). It was an actual digital pen, something that used to be specialized and expensive external hardware, and it worked beautifully with the iPad. It was literally “stylus but GOOD”. I saw it and thought “people will make memes about this, but Apple totally gets it”.

When they introduced the Vision Pro, VR was just kind of shit. Bulky, ugly, uncool. Vision Pro tried to resolve some of the issues, but it was still kind of half-assed. Like they wanted to have a VR device but couldn’t actually make it work. Good resolution, but not great. Vergence-accomodation conflict not addressed. Still bulky and ugly. Isolation kind of addressed (with the AR-ish UX and the “see-through” display), but not enough.

Now we got the foldable iPhone and a touchscreen MacBook.

Foldable phones are still awfully delicate and the whole concept doesn’t have a clear “killer” use case. There’s no new UX, no new features, it’s just an iPad Mini in a marginally smaller device that’s expensive as hell. Apple didn’t even try to address the obvious shortcomings, they just built the same stupid thing everyone else is failing to sell.

Touchscreen laptops still wobble, they still get covered with fingerprints, they’re still uncomfortable and there’s still no meaningful UX. This thing doesn’t even try to address any of that. Their marketing images literally just show hands hovering above the keyboard and touching the screen for no good reason. They’ve been mocking touchscreen laptops for years now and now they release one like it’s the most obvious thing ever. 1984 vibes.

[–] samfromnz 1 day ago
> Now we got the foldable iPhone and a touchscreen MacBook.

And the HomeView, which also feels like it lacks a clear “killer” use case.

Maybe I’m just not the intended audience for any of these products, but I’m also starting to wonder if Apple are throwing things at a wall and hoping something will stick.

[–] carlosjobim 1 day ago
Small business POS system/register?
[–] msdz 1 day ago
Last I read you don’t even get an App Store (!) to install third-party apps on the device, so I’m not sure if that’s possible.
[–] carlosjobim 1 day ago
Yes, but that could change. The hardware itself would certainly be capable. And a POS system can also be cloud based, although not ideal. For hotels, these systems are already cloud based, but then the display is a bit small instead.
[–] reaperducer 1 day ago
Last I read you don’t even get an App Store (!) to install third-party apps on the device, so I’m not sure if that’s possible.

It doesn't have its own app store. It runs the apps on your phone, so feel free to add any of the 2,000,000+ apps on the iPhone App Store to it.

[–] krtkush 1 day ago
So, for a commercial POS system to work, you’ll need a home view and an iPhone in its vicinity to work? Why not just use an iPad? I see loads of places using iPads or even just iPhones.
[–] msdz 1 day ago
Hm. I don’t think CarPlay “apps” can do payments, so I’m not sure whether HomeView can, either.
[–] codercotton 1 day ago
Except it has no dev kit, it just runs widgets and carplay UIs...
[–] carlosjobim 1 day ago
And a web browser.
[–] philistine 1 day ago
Tim Cook and his lieutenants were decidedly running on fumes for the last 2-3 years. That's how long these products take to plan and design so that's what we're seeing right now; the last of the Cook era is being released now. Wait for 2-3 years for Ternus and his gang to start doing their work in hardware; on the software side they've already reversed the direction and its hopefully getting better.
[–] bschwindHN 1 day ago
> on the software side they've already reversed the direction and its hopefully getting better

What things are getting better for you on the software side? I updated from macos 15 (sequoia) to macos 27 (golden gate) on a mac mini m1, and have mostly just received software regressions and worse performance.

[–] satvikpendem 20 hours ago
Metal 4 for better performance in games, especially the new AI recomps
[–] bschwindHN 17 hours ago
That's funny. I wish they'd use their better performance to not have the system lag at basic rendering over time. Last week I was watching a youtube video, and every time I adjusted the OS volume, the video dropped several frames because macos apparently couldn't render the liquid ass volume control and play the video smoothly at the same time.

A reboot fixed it, but it's just such amateur hour with things that have been solved for decades.

I use spotlight to search for the "spotlight" system preferences window. I open the "spotlight" result with the gear icon next to it (scrolling past the "spotlight.prefPane", whatever that is), and where does it take me? The "general" tab of the settings app, of course!

There are so many more that you'd be forgiven for thinking this is some new company's first release of an OS. But nope, just one of the most valuable companies in the world, fumbling basic software shit.

[–] jaffa2 1 day ago
I hope you are right. still waiting for iphone air flip and a mbp that folds into a tablet with apple pencil support. this is such an obvious product.
[–] asadotzler 1 day ago
It took Cook ~7 years to get Vision Pro out the door. Refreshes? A year or two is usually fine. Entirely new products, not so much. This home stuff has been cooking for about a decade and you can bet HomeView was there in the beginning.
[–] Danox 1 day ago
Took 13 years for Apple Silicon, 6 years to design an Apple modem and it probably will take 3 to 5 years for in-house memory if Apple chooses to do something about the memory cartel, the Vision Pro probably is two generations away, and Apple is probably 2 generations M8 away from with having GPUs beyond the Nvidia 5090, in tech worth while iteration takes time.
[–] fnord77 1 day ago
[–] wpm 1 day ago
Of course he is, he's the CEO of the #2 largest company on the planet.

What would you expect him to do? Come out and say "yeah that thing is shit, really stupid idea, but it was in the product hopper so I dunno we might sell it for a year who cares"?

[–] Toutouxc 18 hours ago
> We needed to get to a point where adding touch didn't make the product lesser in any way. It didn't make it heavier. It didn't make it thicker. That came together with the OLED screen, the best display we've ever put into a Mac. All of these things, and, oh yeah, it has touch as well.

My idea of a good product has always been that either the product embraces a feature and makes it part of its identity, or the feature shouldn’t really be there. Putting touch on a laptop (“first and foremost an indirect-input device” in their own words) just because sometimes someone might find it a bit more convenient for scrolling is an admission of cluelessness.

[–] erklik 1 day ago
... Yes, a CEO is defending a product his company is releasing.. I think this seems a given, right?
[–] bennydog224 1 day ago
Apple nowadays feels like it’s rudderless and grasping at everything for $$$, in turn giving up on their OG design principles.

First Liquid Glass, then the 17’s design, then ads and ecosystem subscription bloat, then Duo/HomeView, and now the touchscreen Mac. Jobs is rolling in his grave.

[–] wpm 1 day ago
When Ive left, he took a ton of talent with him. Apple's Design Studio is full of B players now and it shows. I hope Lamay can right the ship but god everything they make now is just so ugly, from the advertising to the software to the apps.
[–] dur-randir 1 day ago
>When Ive left, he took a ton of talent with him

Good riddance though.

[–] wpm 18 hours ago
monkey paw curls
[–] reinhash 1 day ago
Also they lost the simplicity to their product lineup.

How come they just released a Macbook Pro yesterday with the latest M6 chip, to release the day after another Macbook Pro with a year old chip?

Why is there not one Macbook and one Macbook Pro?

[–] sgerenser 1 day ago
Because the M6 Pro and Max were cancelled. So their alternatives were to either sandbag the base MacBook Pro by leaving it on the M5, which wouldn't make much sense if M6 exists, or wait to release these new Pros until the M7 line is available. Since both of those seemed like a bad plan, they went with this one.
[–] codercotton 1 day ago
I'm all for product line-up simplicity. But the story goes that M6 generation isn't getting Pro/Max/Ultra chips, so only lower-end MBP and consumer SKUs get M6 generation. Seems odd for a redesigned MBP to not get fresher chips. Presumably the M7 generation will get the full chip lineups next year on the second-gen 2 nm process.
[–] Danox 1 day ago
Because they decided to skip it and move forward to the M7 jumping two generations ahead with their pro computers, why not? Seems reasonable in light of their competition wasting billions of dollars on AI models and data centers.

I hope they find time to address the memory problem. Like they addressed their processor problem and their modem problem.

The Apple Silicon design group can certainly do something about it. And Apple certainly has the money after all, they didn’t squander it on AI models.

[–] 233mhz 1 day ago
How else would they get consoomers to keep buying?

I am a dev with a m1 air 16gb and I have 0 reason to update yet, it's been 6 years now, laptops are solved for 90% of people, they need to introduce gimmicks to create demand

[–] dozerly 1 day ago
The people who made Apple what it is today are long gone. The planks have been fully replaced
[–] Danox 1 day ago
What they are today is the only vertical computer company left from the 1980s. Who else is there today at scale?, Apple is in a very good position in comparison to most of the competition. Apple need only to solve the memory problem.

That is actually more important, because just recently one of the members of the three-headed cartel said/reiterated again that (memory gouging) is going to last till 2030 and beyond.

[–] 100percentjake 1 day ago
This. 100% this. My first look at their marketing images resulted in "well, that's the most awkward looking thing I've ever seen."
[–] ragazzina 1 day ago
>When they introduced the Apple Pencil and people were like “haha it’s a stylus”, the thing was decidedly NOT a stylus

Ironic: when they introduced the Apple Watch, the narrative around it was "whatever it will be, it WON'T be just another smartwatch" and yet it was.

[–] asadotzler 1 day ago
The lesson Cook too from that was "don't let it happen" and that's why Apple gave Vision Pro game devs the middle finger saying there would be no precision controllers and then charging $3500-$4500 so that it couldn't possibly be confused with Quest and its gaming focus. Apple wanted Excel and Zoom, not Beat Saber. It got neither, selling less well than Nintendo's 1995 Virtual Boy (no shit.)
[–] lvl256 1 day ago
Apple lost its magic long time ago.
[–] mmmmmbop 1 day ago
The iPhone Duo is extremely well-executed. There are some first-gen tradeoffs for sure but this is already the best phone I’ve ever used.
[–] stevage 19 hours ago
I would expect every phone I buy to be the best phone I've ever used. That's how technology works, isn't it?
[–] static_motion 22 hours ago
The seemingly widespread reports of display cracking due to hinge issues makes me question that it is "extremely well-executed".
[–] chrisco255 1 day ago
Yeah and OP is incorrect, foldables are a rapidly growing segment in mobile phones. Having used one for over a year, I'm not going back, and had the Duo been out a couple months ago, I probably would have bought that instead of the Fold8.
[–] Geof25 19 hours ago
Foldables to me look like a fad. People are using them now because it looks cool, but I have seen people to return back to normal phones due to unreliability of foldables.
[–] crystaln 1 day ago
The Duo does have a killer use case at least for me: multitasking

Game + Video

Messaging + Browsing

App + Development

Notes + Research

etc

[–] Toutouxc 1 day ago
That’s not a killer use case, that’s just running two apps next to each other. There are tons of phones and tablets that can do that.

I want to know why I want my phone to cost twice as much and have a dozen delicate moving parts in order to fold. Like the movie quote: “sell me this pen”. I’m waiting for someone to sell me a folding phone. I thought Apple would be able to do it, but they haven’t even tried.

[–] chrisco255 1 day ago
For me, I'm reading more books because my e-reader is with me everywhere I go. The unfolded mode is fantastic for reading. It's obviously great for video too, a nearly 8 inch screen in your pocket is a big upgrade. Honestly it's big enough to comfortably use a terminal app like Termux as well. It's excellent for any note taking app you use. I use Obsidian, having more real estate is really important for long, detailed notes, plus tabs are easier to navigate there and in the browser, which of course also benefits from the bigger screen (most websites look better on bigger screens).
[–] nozzlegear 1 day ago
> That’s not a killer use case, that’s just running two apps next to each other. There are tons of phones and tablets that can do that.

But they aren't iPhones.

[–] mplewis 1 day ago
Running two apps next to each other isn't practical on a normal sized phone. That's why the Duo folds out into a larger screen.
[–] ako 1 day ago
Use an iPad. For the price of a duo you can purchase an iPad Air and an iPhone, even more screens, you can run even more apps next to each other. And the iPad can extend its screen to a normal display if you want to run even more apps.
[–] ghostghostghost 20 hours ago
You are completely ignoring the importance of pocketability and having something with you all the time. My old M1 iPad Pro remains severely underused eating dust because I'm never carrying that thing around with me, including in my work bag.
[–] npunt 1 day ago
But once you add the price of cargo pants it's a wash tho.
[–] codercotton 1 day ago
Yea but, a foldable is way more portable and I'll have it with me always. It will be a nice mobile productivity boost for me.
[–] jedberg 1 day ago
No but at the current price you can just carry two phones. :)
[–] ghusto 1 day ago
Aside from the fact that you can not do two things at the same time, all the other phones, foldable or not can do this for not a gagillion dollars.
[–] 72deluxe 21 hours ago
I am not sure how you would play a game and watch a video at the same time, unless you have independent eyes?
[–] smlacy 1 day ago
ADHD + Life
[–] dyarosla 1 day ago
Agree except for the Vision Pro- they messed up the hardware but the software was very refined.

Truly unclear what the usecases of each of these new products is however.

[–] asadotzler 1 day ago
Foldables are somewhere between 10 and 15 percent of Samsung flagship sales. It's foolish to underestimate them because Silicon Valley was all using slabs. The rest of the world isn't so prudish and after sleeping around some many settled on foldables and have been using them for many generations. Moving 10-15% of your high-end sales into an ultra-high-end is a huge win.