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points by Isamu 13 hours ago | 0 comments
To me the dream of AI is: an agent can do the drudge work of tracking every statement down to the supporting reference, documentation and ultimately the work involved in verifying.

It is NOT being used for this, instead we want faster “answers” that avoid due diligence. Same as always but lazier.

[–] rancar2 12 hours ago
Agreed, and there is already a solution that’s better to support anyway. It may not be perfect, but Wikipedia operates on this model at scale at a much smaller annual budget than any of the AI companies and has produced much higher quality content overtime for all of humanities benefit than the AI teams which are most just scraping the work of others while spending most of their original work to replace human labor for their own financial benefit.

Wikipedia community bans AI-generated entries because verifying and removing AI hallucinations imposes even more workload on editors than writing articles from scratch [1, 2].

If you don’t agree that Wikipedia’s approach, one can always fork it like was done with SpaceX / Twitter did with its launch of Grokipedia on October 27, 2025, which hasn’t been really incorporating much improvement well with lots of digressions in its quality and reliability [3].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Writing_articles_wit...

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Editing_policy#Artif...

[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grokipedia#Reliability

[Edited for better formatting]

[–] bradknowles 4 hours ago
This is exactly how I use Claude in all of my technical writing. I even wrote a skill for this.

Every claim has to be backed up by a reference. Every reference has to be double-checked. Primary sources are much preferred over secondary sources, and where no primary source can be found, that must be noted.

I also insist on simpler, more easy-to-understand writing, even if that makes the total output longer. Aiming at a general audience, of the same reading level as a standard newspaper.

Most of the rest of the skill is about ensuring the Chicago Manual of Style is properly followed, widow/orphan control and how that applies to callout boxes, tables, etc….

[–] ArtRichards 1 hour ago
link? care to share? :) i often find myself starting with a tone guide.
[–] HighlandSpring 13 hours ago
I've had the same thought as probably have many others - what solutions exist in this space?

To put it into words: a layer over an LLM that tracks provenance: the documents it has access to, the facts it has extracted, the mathematical expressions and queries it's run and finally the artifacts and results it's yielded complete with receipts for exactly how it arrived at it's findings and conclusions.

I assume legaltech products have to do it like this. Is the general pattern implemented somewhere on github?

[–] cyclecycle 10 hours ago
yeah i work on this at https://groundedai.company/

we build a product called Veracity focused on citation and claim checking. legal is a major focus for us, also scientific and technical publishing, where we detect hallucinated citations in submitted works and all that jazz

planning to release something soon focused on the LLM harness layer

we've been working on the problem for years. gradually getting traction

all completely closed source atm, though we often revisit that discussion

i would contest a sibling comment - the solution is not RAG, at least not entirely. 1) because it doesn't necessarily involve 'generation' (e.g our grounding model doesn't depend on gen ai) and 2) RAG is just enriching the context. even if you can get the retrieval right (not a given) it doesn't guarentee that the LLM will faithfully or correctly use that context, or that all its claims are supported by sources. RAG is not the same as traceability and verification

[–] calebkaiser 10 hours ago
I'm working on something around this that I'm hopeful I can open source in the next couple of weeks. It's just a research project, so not like a product that can be bought and shipped to prod right away, but I'm excited about it. I think a lot of people are working on this right now, at least in part, with things like memory layers and other approaches to "grounding", or with some of the more recent stuff around certification and governance. But there's sort of a split right now between:

- Groups focused strictly on model capability (i.e. benchmark scores)

- Groups really focused on governance, interpretability, control planes, etc

- A small but excitable minority of weirdos (me included) who think they're the same thing

A lot of the stuff that gets loosely clustered under neurosymbolic methods might be interesting if you're looking to dive in. The sort of pattern you're describing is something that a lot of people have taken stabs at from different directions, or at least have tangentially nipped at while working on related problems.

[–] pampa 11 hours ago
The name of the solution is RAG - retreival augumented generation. It is pretty easy to whip up your own over a corpus of material. I built one for myself within a week over a corpus of my favorite cook and homebrewing books. All you need is source material, postgress (pgvect) and some compute (llama.cpp with a decent chat model for chunking and labeling, an embedding and a rerank model. or some $ to use those via a router). When the corpus is indexed, you use your favorite coding agent and a system prompt that forces the model to answer only from search results.
[–] skydhash 12 hours ago
Not sure why a solution is even needed. If I had to compile all the resources I had consulted for something like C programming, they wouldn't amount to a single shelf. I would say the same thing for research where the amount of sources is still very low. It's kinda reminded me of the big paper manuals and books before the internet. I don't think the whole library of congress was needed to write UNIX.

So AI being a source of truth and information is not a something that important. It's a generator and we should use it as such, getting it to map domains and repeating patterns. It should not be used as an encyclopedia or oracle.

[–] burningChrome 10 hours ago
>> If I had to compile all the resources I had consulted for something like C programming, they wouldn't amount to a single shelf.

Serious question - with something like a programming language where there is a sort of finite information available about the language and how to use it. I've found once you start moving into areas where this isn't the case like metaphysics where there is a lot more ambiguity, does the sourcing and information then become more valuable? Or are we going to finally be ok with ambiguity as humans?

I can see what you're saying and agree, but are there areas where sourcing does in fact become more important?

[–] skydhash 9 hours ago
> does the sourcing and information then become more valuable? Or are we going to finally be ok with ambiguity as humans?

I think they do become more valuable. Who said something and who believe it is equally as important as what was said.

[–] pandemic_region 12 hours ago
But soon, the majority of those references, documentation and work will be AI generated. We are peeing and likely defecating in our own water well.
[–] boringg 13 hours ago
I mean you can definitely do that - just set it up do to that.

What you are describing is that a majority of humans are inherently not interested in that. There are are a subset of people who would like to do that - and certainly can now that they have the tooling.

Its just a vastly strong tool. If you want it, build it.

[–] hn_acc1 12 hours ago
I think it's more that the majority of humans DON'T REALIZE it's NOT doing that.

Most people think AI answers are carefully sourced, triple vetted, over-researched to death and can trust it with their life, despite the warnings, until they run into nonsense and then dismiss it as a one-off.

If there was a "always give the best possible, most researched and trusted answer" flag that was easily visible, or maybe "chatGpt" and "bestAnswersGpt", where the second one did all the verification and was considered much better overall, guess which one people would start using after a while and/or quote, because of improved accuracy?

It's not that people don't WANT honest information (well, most people) - they just don't KNOW they're not getting it right now. That's the problem with tech - they're trading on "computers were always right in the past" because there has been no generally available "fuzzy search" type application that needs handholding to give "good" results. Most software either gave the result of computations that are always the same, or enforced static rules (like spellcheck) which were perceived as "always right".

[–] jameshart 11 hours ago
‘AI’ isn’t giving unsourced answers. Hastily cobbled together chatbots based on LLMs, inadequately prompted and without adequate research tools, are being put on the internet by humans and giving unsourced answers.

Well prompted LLMs with appropriate tools can do exactly what OP asked for. So AI can do this. That the AI-based products people are being given don’t is not a limitation of AI, it is a failure of humans.

[–] AlienRobot 5 hours ago
Google overview frequently cites webpages that don't include the keywords of a query.

This is Google, the most used search engine in the world, made by a company that is at the forefront of AI development.

ChatGPT, Claude, etc,. constantly generate answers without sources and rarely cite anything verbatim. I'm not sure if they could cite something verbatim even if they wanted.

Essentially none of these tools are appropriate for information.